Desktop environment for Linux

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eldmannen
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Desktop environment for Linux

Post by eldmannen » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:36 pm

I think it would be cool to run ReactOS as a desktop environment in Linux.
In Linux you can choose which desktop environment to use, e.g. GNOME or KDE.
It would be nice to run ReactOS as a desktop environment.

So you install 'reactos-environment' from the repository, and it installs not the whole ReactOS operating system (not the kernel), but the user-land applications.
So you run Linux but with the ReactOS shell and explorer, and associated utilities such as Notepad, Wordpad, Charmap, etc.

This way you get all the benefits of Linux, the stability and amount huge of open-source software together with the familiar user-interface and experience of ReactOS.

kevintrooper
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by kevintrooper » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:21 pm

eldmannen wrote: This way you get all the benefits of Linux, the stability and amount huge of open-source software together with the familiar user-interface and experience of ReactOS.
I like the idea!
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vicmarcal
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by vicmarcal » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:26 pm

Let´s make a good ReactOS...and then we will make Desktop enviroments, support for 9 types of Files System and everything we want ;)...but first let´s make reactos useful :D
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hto
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by hto » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:37 pm


.aart3k
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by .aart3k » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:48 pm

Some people just make me laugh

eldmannen
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by eldmannen » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:59 pm

vicmarcal,
The desktop environment already exists in ReactOS, it just needs to be packaged for Linux.

GoBusto
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by GoBusto » Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:01 am

eldmannen wrote:vicmarcal,
The desktop environment already exists in ReactOS, it just needs to be packaged for Linux.
"Just"?

Haos
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by Haos » Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:02 am

What do you understand by the term of desktop environment? The reactos shell, aka Explorer??

oiaohm
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by oiaohm » Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:46 am

This idea show a lack of understanding of the difference between Linux Windows Managers and Windows Shells.

I am sorry to say there are a long list of incompatibilities running a shell even inside wine to control X11 applications is not even practical. Little things like icon sizes don't even line up. Then the API used in both are no where near related is the reason why KDE 4.x is only bring across userland applications to windows. To bring across a shell/window manager across the API divide of X11 api and windows api is a massive and complex operation.

There are many windows managers for Linux that get close to cloning look and fell of windows like http://www.xpde.com/. Lot of reactos user land applications will work in http://winehq.org without issue.

The simple fact it is simpler to build a new windows manager from nothing for X11 than really try to port a shell from windows. Seams like a good idea until you see how complex the process is. AROS and other OS's can pull it off because the way there API works does line up with X11 API. Windows API design for theming icon sizes what a shell controls are all different to the X11 Windows manager models.

Simple ideas can be almost imposable to do.

Haos
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by Haos » Tue Oct 07, 2008 1:14 am

oiaohm, afaiu the OP wants to port reactos userland/shell to *nix as well as package it... which is pretty strange idea after all.

Sand
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by Sand » Tue Oct 07, 2008 1:56 am

Wine also has its own Explorer and it is already packaged with Linux. You can use Wine Explorer as default environment.

oiaohm
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by oiaohm » Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:34 am

Sand I would not recommend that ever. Number 1 wine explorer does not have freedesktop intergration so does not pick up Linux applications menu entries or linux applicaton mine interfaces by default. Number 2 does not draw the boarders of windows that a wm is required to do in X11.

There is no simple way to do this. I do support for wine so yes I know its limits well.

Sand
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by Sand » Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:49 am

Wine includes its own window manager that draws windows borders for wine applications (if you choose it instead of standard wm).

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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by EmuandCo » Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:46 pm

If someone really wants to put much effort in such a stupid idea, go on. We won't do it for sure. We try to create a FOSS Windows, nor a Linux Environment, neither a file explorer. And whoever says its Easy to port a Windows only app to Linux by !!!!JUST!!!! repackaging it should hide in the darkest corner he can find.
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ReactOS is still in alpha stage, meaning it is not feature-complete and is recommended only for evaluation and testing purposes.

oiaohm
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Re: Desktop environment for Linux

Post by oiaohm » Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:46 pm

Sand it really does not include its own windows manager. You really don't understand what you are looking at. The 3 modes of wine.

Next 3 quote codeweavers crossover manual but they are the same in wine same code better written in closed source manual.
Managed
Ordinary top-level frame windows with thick borders, title bars, and system menus will be managed by your window manager.
Ok Normal wine mode. where wm is in control and windows title bar/border operations disregarded

Unmanaged / Normal

Window manager independent (any running window manager is ignored completely). Window decorations (title bars, borders, etc) are drawn by Wine to look and feel like the real Windows.
This mode is the one you most likely think is doing something usable. Bad news its not. It is still interfacing with operating wm just tells it not to draw anything exactly like xmms and other programs that want to draw there own bits do. For window placement management still goes back to the operating X11 WM.

Desktop-in-a-Box Mode Closet to a real WM of all but cannot operate as a WM for linux applications. All windows placements are done relative to the Window its contained in. Also due to it creating a single graphical image in that box getting X11 applications working in there will be a mess and ending up double mapped. One in X11 terms and one in Windows terms that the Windows system understands.

Simple fact Wine does not include its own stand alone windows manager. Yes it has some parts with many 100'h of hours of work could be twisted into 1 yet would run poorly. Less hours are need to create a X11 WM that looks like windows will run faster than in wine and use less ram basically works.

Just because something appears to be something does not make it that it is no matter how much we pray.

My self
Number 2 does not draw the boarders of windows that a wm is required to do in X11.
Ie it don't draw boarders for windows that are not wine or manage windows other than its own.

You are not the first to have this idea or the last Sand. I think you are the first to put it in the reactos forums. If you go back threw the wine mailing list it has been put up many times and every time ripped to shreds for being non practicals. Last one said processing windows themes in a Native X11 WM would be a far more productive method. No coder that I know of has stepped up to do that either.

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