ReactOS containing Windows code?

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RandomMe
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Post by RandomMe » Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:02 am

1. How does he know it's stolen code from Windows ? Did he have a look at the Windows code himself ?

2. If there is stolen code - drop the code and drop the guy who stole it. Where's the problem ?

3. You can't avoid having smiliarities in the code - like someone said before, sometimes there is only one (smart) way to do it.

Oh, and Mircosoft will attack ReactOS one day anyway. ReactOs isn't much of a threat yet. But once it gets really usable Microsoft will do something.

rrobin
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Post by rrobin » Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:33 am

RandomMe wrote:Oh, and Mircosoft will attack ReactOS one day anyway. ReactOs isn't much of a threat yet. But once it gets really usable Microsoft will do something.
"Once it gets really usable"? Version 3.0 might be ready to be distributed preinstalled!! :D

News on this topic is scarce.. What are the implications for the ROS project if there are similarities in code?

Best wishes to the DevTeam.

Lolo
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Post by Lolo » Fri Jan 20, 2006 1:56 pm

Please stop talking about what you can not understand !

Like Ged told it, Harmut Birr is one of the earliest and most respected developers.

So if he told it, with his knowledge (that only earliest developer of ROS could have), he has enough skills to be sure of what he told. And he has explain how he found it! So if you read, you'll find the information !

The other developers (the only ones that could really understand!) have asked Harmut to locate this (those) part(s) of the code. They'll be able to find the "guilty" developer(s) and to rewrite this code.

They will exclude or not this developer, this is not your or my buisiness. Let them work and build this amazing OS.

mikedep333
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Post by mikedep333 » Fri Jan 20, 2006 3:17 pm

What I'm surprised about is that this is big enough news to almost stop development, but I can't find stuff about it on the mailing list (the archives) like these.
http://www.reactos.org/archives/public/ ... /date.html
http://www.reactos.org/archives/public/ ... /date.html

dr_asfak
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Post by dr_asfak » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:05 pm

Lolo wrote:Please stop talking about what you can not understand !
There is one sincere request to all non -developer member to please post your comments only if you are thorough with the subject. This has been very serious discussion, and such comments just diverts (or frustrates) our programmers.

Thanks

ThePhysicist
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Post by ThePhysicist » Fri Jan 20, 2006 8:24 pm

This is very strange!

Two German (w3seek gone? wiki says so) and an Italian developer have suddenly gone without much words about it. i have a really bad feeling about that, but I hope I will be corrected by someone.

1.) After working years on such a great project like ROS and investing lots of time it seems unbelievable that these devs just go without fighting for the project. They might have stronger reasons.

2.) Suing a huge OS project like ROS might not be very easy, it's easier to sue single developers. It might be more successful and doesn't attract too much attention.

3.) MS will use DRM stuff in Vista, ROS will probably not. So who do you think might have the most interest in closing down ROS? Maybe huge film/music companies(?) And you might have heard about German lawyers' common practice of sending dissuasions (is this the right word?). They force people to sign a declaration of discontinuance with a penalty clause.

This is only speculation and I hope it's not true.
Please correct me, if you think this is stupid or you know better.

GvG
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Post by GvG » Fri Jan 20, 2006 9:58 pm

Just to make it absolutely clear: there has been no external pressure. Internally there are disagreements.

DaleCoz
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Unfortunate reality

Post by DaleCoz » Sat Jan 21, 2006 2:30 am

I'm not a lawyer, but I've had some contact with the court system, and that contact tells me one thing: The unforunate reality is that it is not enough for the bits of Reactos code in question to be technically legal. Now that a Reactos developer has publicly stated that they appear to be copied from Windows, those sections of code essentially have to be replaced using strict cleanroom techniques. That may not be fair, but not doing so leaves the project very vulnerable to a lawsuit. Let's face it. If Reactos ever starts to catch on, Microsoft will sue. They will have the best lawyers money can buy. Those lawyers will read the mailing list archives and grin from ear-to-ear because the things that have been said on the mailing list are very powerful evidence of copying from the words of one of Reactos's own developers. Maybe those words shouldn't have been said, but once they were the code has to be made unquestionably legal.
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Viator
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Post by Viator » Sun Jan 22, 2006 12:37 am

There are many ways MS can attack ROS without suing a few would be to pay of developers to quit. Pay them to take as long as possible at coding so that by time its finished its almost irrelevant or to pay one of to introduce windows code into ROS or To pay one off to SAY windows code is in there.
Think about it microsift would lose billions f ROS became stable mature and fast. They can and will do what ever they can to stunt stop or discredit ROS
theyve done it to linux ROS is next on the list.

Xor
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Post by Xor » Sun Jan 22, 2006 2:12 am

whoa, lets take it easy with the consiracy theories there pardner. I pretty much doubt that microsoft is taking any active stance towards reactos anytime soon, if ever.

as for the 'stolen' code, here's hoping it's it's a mistake, or if not, that it's highly exaggerated. from what I understand, this stolen source code within reactos seems to be more or less manually converted straight from dissassembled windows code into c code, right? my question is then how big and advanced would this alledgedly 'stolen' chunk of code be?

to me it would have to be quite sizeable, else similarities would fall under mere circumstance, yet how big can it be, if someone has actually disassembled windows code and been able to spot such extreme silimarities that they would choose to leave the project?

also hoping that if it is indeed 'stolen' code, that it isn't an crucial piece of code that will take a long time to rewrite, as it would be a shame to trip and fall now when reactos is on such a fasttrack.

MadRat
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Post by MadRat » Sun Jan 22, 2006 3:57 am

If you take a binary and create an equivalent chunk of code in c - then compile back into a binary - then it would seem that it should be quite a bit slower than one done natively in binary. The fact that so few people understand coding at the machine level is what will make this task of "cleaning up the code" all the more difficult. I hate to say it, but it wouldn't be outside of a large company's desperation tactic to stay afloat that would prevent them from unethically introducing tainted code into an open source project in an attempt to shut it down. With WINE and ROS making rapid inroads on Microsoft you know they are going to do something underhanded sooner then later.
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EmuandCo
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Post by EmuandCo » Sun Jan 22, 2006 10:06 pm

I'm very quiet in Forum, but some surely know me from Chat. Now I have a bunch of questions.

My little brother wants to test ReactOS, but after those stories with reverse engineering Windows Files and adding this almost 1:1 into ReactOS, I want to know if its legal to use ReactOS?

Did you already punish the baaad guys who did it?

Do you do something against those parts in Source already?

What about Hartmut Birr? Did he say something about coming back?

And the most important: Is WaxDragon still around? Last time I saw him in Chat he was named Wax|SAD and he said something like: It WAS nice with you...

cmoibenlepro
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Post by cmoibenlepro » Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:00 pm

Any news? :?: :?: :?:

exspastic
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hiya-

Post by exspastic » Mon Jan 23, 2006 1:09 am

first off- i'm not a programmer for this project. i'm just a dude who's been checking out this site every now and again & read up when i heard about this windows code stuff.

i think the devolpers of this software are taking these claims very seriously & problems are being address- but from what i gather they have chosen to do it in private and not get everybody involved. and rightfully so- they don't need wild rumors floating around.

i don't want to stick my foot in my mouth or interfere- i just think someone out there needs to kinda say this to 'the public.' (ie i'm trying to help here)

1) there is no windows code in reactOS. from what i understand- this is a case of someone reading up so much on how windows & trying really hard to get things to work right- that thier work actually began to brush the line. & now people are looking at it going - geez this is just a little too close.

2) from what i understand the code is being rewritten/reverted/fixed. everybody's doing the right thing.

3) as i said before- from what i gather- this is being handled in private.

so- download reactOS if you want. it's safe. relax- the project isn't going anywhere. guys are back on track with adding code now. it's all good. it's windows free. just somebody started to get a bit of 'tunnel vision' going on with how they were trying to do things.

if any of the devolpers for reactOS feel this is inaccurate- please feel free to comment. if i've said anything too far out of line- feel free to edit this post. i'm just trying to help- i don't think you need alot of weird rumors flying around.

Ged
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Post by Ged » Mon Jan 23, 2006 1:15 am

EmuandCo wrote: My little brother wants to test ReactOS, but after those stories with reverse engineering Windows Files and adding this almost 1:1 into ReactOS, I want to know if its legal to use ReactOS?
Of course it is. Many people who have posted on this thread are making accusations without knowing the facts. It's been blown out of proportion.
Did you already punish the baaad guys who did it?
It still hasn't even been proven that there is dissasembled asm in there which couldn't have been done any other way. The case continues ;)
What about Hartmut Birr? Did he say something about coming back?
Not sure, but I hope so.
And the most important: Is WaxDragon still around? Last time I saw him in Chat he was named Wax|SAD and he said something like: It WAS nice with you...
He's left :(

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