Public Relations

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PurpleGurl
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Public Relations

Post by PurpleGurl » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:27 am

I could have included this under Recruiting, but I didn't want to cause a thread split. These are similar topics, but with differences. Recruiting is getting more people to help, while public relations has more to do with the public image. If we have a poor public perception, then recruiting will be hard.

I just typed in ReactOS in YouTube and sorted in reverse chronological order and discovered people were in there ripping 0.3.13 to shreds. In one of those, the fellow showed how various things crashed and showed the screen turning odd colors. It dropped color depth for some reason, and he had to keep putting it back to 16m.

Some of the comments for some of the older Reactos videos were quite awful. One essentially called it a free version of Windows for poor ghetto dwellers. (Yes, I cleaned it up here for our eyes, but they used a racial slur.) Another falsely accused us of using the leaked Windows 2000 code. There was quite a bit of debating of whether we would exist without Linux. They said if there was no Linux, there would be no Wine, and without Wine, there would be no Reactos either. Then there were negative GUI comments. "Hey, this looks like Windows 95!" I read a defense of that from at least one user saying something like, "I would rather it be stable and ugly than look very modern and crash all the time."

So it seems like a "catch-22" situation. We don't have the progress we'd like because we don't have the people and skill sets necessary to do it faster. Yet, with the poor perception, we don't get the number of fans and potential developers that we'd like. How do we fix this? How do we get people to look at ReactOS in context without unreasonable expectations and still keep a positive public image? I mean, I don't care to see comments like: "Go to Reactos.org if you want to install this piece of crap." Hey, we are still alpha, so what do they expect? The developers we have are doing an excellent job, and I hope the nonsense and gripes won't dishearten them. They need everyone's support, not the type of comments you find on YouTube about us.
Last edited by PurpleGurl on Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

vicmarcal
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Re: Public Relations

Post by vicmarcal » Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:57 am

One of the things ReactOS needs is the creation of a PR team. I've suggested it and I am on it right now :)..Team is opened to anyone.We need to cover events, magazines, create blogs in several languages. Creating a flood of positive news will help attract new users but also covering the typical negative comments.
But there aren't too many PR guys around...
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wojo664
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Re: Public Relations

Post by wojo664 » Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:40 pm

I was thinking from some time about some traditional announcements placed on some (normal) surfaces. But what text write on to such announcement?

There are plenty of such things that we can stick them on. Bus stops, tram stops, announcement boards, walls...

I can print some announcements on my super fast needle printer :D

What I can see now is a vesy small amount of Polish users here :(
Maybe such advertisements would bring some people here?

Also If You like, You would use some of my videos for advertising purposes ;)

Haos
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Re: Public Relations

Post by Haos » Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:03 pm

When advertising, you kinda need a product.... which we kinda dont have.

Murmur
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Re: Public Relations

Post by Murmur » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:45 pm

Haos wrote:When advertising, you kinda need a product.... which we kinda dont have.
Actually, I disagree. The code itself is a product, we need developers right now and that is our target market.

What we need to do is advertise for developers and make it technical. We can't just be like "OMG reactos, great OS try it out" because people will pop it into their pc, notice its not done and walk away and forget about it. After the project gets to a proper milestone then we can focus more on general users.

I have said before I wish to help with the PR but with that we need communications with the development team and decide on a few things.
wojo664 wrote:I was thinking from some time about some traditional announcements placed on some (normal) surfaces. But what text write on to such announcement?

There are plenty of such things that we can stick them on. Bus stops, tram stops, announcement boards, walls...

I can print some announcements on my super fast needle printer :D

What I can see now is a vesy small amount of Polish users here :(
Maybe such advertisements would bring some people here?

Also If You like, You would use some of my videos for advertising purposes ;)
This is exactly what we DON'T need right now.

This will do a few things...
1. Cost money
2. Generate bad press
3. Drive away a chance of getting proper funding.

b4dc0d3r
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Re: Public Relations

Post by b4dc0d3r » Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:26 am

People commenting on Youtube are not statistically in the top tri-quartile of intelligence, and are most likely capable of drooling in the direction of, but not exactly on, an operating system.

Someone capable of contributing should look at those and think, maybe I could fix that. The more bug reports the better, even if they are on Youtube. If nothing else, a video reply where the bugs are gone would be appropriate to show progress. I'm not volunteering for that one, but it would be a good job for someone interested in the testing aspect. Once it works, record it and post as a response with a very simple "This works now, and thanks for your testing, people like you finding issues are a great help."

A user looks at something that doesn't work and complains. A developer looks at the same thing and thinks... we should fix that. The open source products I've been interested in helping have been the broken ones, not the ones doing fine.

As for the source code leak, a simple search for reactos and leaked code reveals the audit saga. Wine people don't trust the project as a result of stupid accusations, to their detriment. But it is not out of line to say that Wine benefits ReactOS. Before the audit, it worked both ways, now ReactOS basically files bug reports and hopes it gets fixed. It could work better, but reality forks, and it forks hard. Without Linux, there would probably not be a need for Wine, so I'd say that's fair as well. It's obviously work that could be done, but ReactOS made a smart decision in leveraging existing open source code, which is what we're supposed to do. This shows how open source works, is supposed to work. Wine did not intend to make a Windows clone possible, but that's the whole point. Write some source, release it, and see what people do with it. When the unexpected happens, it can be beautiful.

If anyone wants to compare ReactOS with the leaked Windows source code, I'd just say go ahead. The rules are: interfaces are not copyrightable, and some code has been made public by MSDN or technical articles or books, and some reverse engineering is legal, depending on your country's laws. If they can keep that in their heads, and find the leak, I'd be interested in what someone finds. Otherwise they can shut their pieholes.

My thoughts only, I speak for no one else.

EmuandCo
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Re: Public Relations

Post by EmuandCo » Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:26 am

b4dc0d3r wrote:People commenting on Youtube are not statistically in the top tri-quartile of intelligence, and are most likely capable of drooling in the direction of, but not exactly on, an operating system.

Someone capable of contributing should look at those and think, maybe I could fix that. The more bug reports the better, even if they are on Youtube. If nothing else, a video reply where the bugs are gone would be appropriate to show progress. I'm not volunteering for that one, but it would be a good job for someone interested in the testing aspect. Once it works, record it and post as a response with a very simple "This works now, and thanks for your testing, people like you finding issues are a great help."

A user looks at something that doesn't work and complains. A developer looks at the same thing and thinks... we should fix that. The open source products I've been interested in helping have been the broken ones, not the ones doing fine.

As for the source code leak, a simple search for reactos and leaked code reveals the audit saga. Wine people don't trust the project as a result of stupid accusations, to their detriment. But it is not out of line to say that Wine benefits ReactOS. Before the audit, it worked both ways, now ReactOS basically files bug reports and hopes it gets fixed. It could work better, but reality forks, and it forks hard. Without Linux, there would probably not be a need for Wine, so I'd say that's fair as well. It's obviously work that could be done, but ReactOS made a smart decision in leveraging existing open source code, which is what we're supposed to do. This shows how open source works, is supposed to work. Wine did not intend to make a Windows clone possible, but that's the whole point. Write some source, release it, and see what people do with it. When the unexpected happens, it can be beautiful.

If anyone wants to compare ReactOS with the leaked Windows source code, I'd just say go ahead. The rules are: interfaces are not copyrightable, and some code has been made public by MSDN or technical articles or books, and some reverse engineering is legal, depending on your country's laws. If they can keep that in their heads, and find the leak, I'd be interested in what someone finds. Otherwise they can shut their pieholes.

My thoughts only, I speak for no one else.
Best post of the Week. Fully 2nded
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ReactOS is still in alpha stage, meaning it is not feature-complete and is recommended only for evaluation and testing purposes.

Aeneas
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Re: Public Relations

Post by Aeneas » Sat Jun 25, 2011 6:38 am

I, too, think that you DO need PR, and all the ifs, buts and when dissolve when you think of it this way - the worst thing that can happen is that you "mess up". Then, you would be exactly where you are now, so no loss here. - The best thing is broad popularity with professionals. - You might argue that the failing also can "carry a bad name for the future", well, that is a) still better than no name at all as you are at least known and b) there is not all too much of a future if ReactOS is still pretty much in the status of today in 2015 (I mean, hobby-wise, yes, but as always I am proposing to you World Domination).

As to youtube... well...

http://xkcd.com/202/

mfldelton
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Re: Public Relations

Post by mfldelton » Mon Jun 27, 2011 7:18 am

Well, I think we may spend some time to tweet when we publish the latest issue of newsletter / new, and when we get some excited commits as well as getting long-awaited bugs fixed. ;)

I can offer my help to tweet in Chinese as well as blogging :D

zimbra
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Re: Public Relations

Post by zimbra » Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:52 am

Speaking of public relations, I got a go get ReactOS comment on the Freedos list along with a complain over there one. Let's see, if I complain I'll be banned.

I'm not going to complain, but I am going to point out that comments like shut your pie hole are NOT constructive.

Unfortunately, people are saying nasty things about ReactOS on youtube. What about what is on this forum? Shut your pie hole is just the tip of the ice berg. There are some major and frankly intimidating egos on this forum. What you do when someone bad mouths you is you disarm them with kindness. I will hit you with a hammer is not kindness. I will have you taken off of the Internet is not kindness. The better way to deal with a person who is badmouthing you is to patiently remind them that this project is still in alpha stage and not feature complete yet.

As far as the you can reverse engineer if you are in certain countries but not others, I don't accept that. Nobody has a monopoly on brains. Original ideas are safe ideas. As far as reverse engineering being a problem in any country, if bad laws aren't defied they stick. I don't think ideas themselves can be copy protected. If the Windows idea is protected property, then ReactOS is illegal. What I say if your country doesn't allow reverse engineering is to defy that in large numbers. A government that tries to arrest all of its citizens is a government that will fall. ReactOS needs to be a worldwide phenomenon where bad laws could prevent that if they aren't challenged. There are undoubtedly people under bad laws who want to help with ReactOS that can't. Microsoft is not a government poster child.. An antitrust case against you is NOT a reward for good business practices.

Good PR is as much about project developers and project moderators as it is about the public at large or in segments. Any PR campaign that will succeed has to address what the developers and moderators say that is damaging to this project's public image. Leaving threads on this board where someone is attacked personally is not helping.

EmuandCo
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Re: Public Relations

Post by EmuandCo » Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:01 pm

zimbra wrote:Speaking of public relations, I got a go get ReactOS comment on the Freedos list along with a complain over there one. Let's see, if I complain I'll be banned.

I'm not going to complain, but I am going to point out that comments like shut your pie hole are NOT constructive.

Unfortunately, people are saying nasty things about ReactOS on youtube. What about what is on this forum? Shut your pie hole is just the tip of the ice berg. There are some major and frankly intimidating egos on this forum. What you do when someone bad mouths you is you disarm them with kindness. I will hit you with a hammer is not kindness. I will have you taken off of the Internet is not kindness. The better way to deal with a person who is badmouthing you is to patiently remind them that this project is still in alpha stage and not feature complete yet.

As far as the you can reverse engineer if you are in certain countries but not others, I don't accept that. Nobody has a monopoly on brains. Original ideas are safe ideas. As far as reverse engineering being a problem in any country, if bad laws aren't defied they stick. I don't think ideas themselves can be copy protected. If the Windows idea is protected property, then ReactOS is illegal. What I say if your country doesn't allow reverse engineering is to defy that in large numbers. A government that tries to arrest all of its citizens is a government that will fall. ReactOS needs to be a worldwide phenomenon where bad laws could prevent that if they aren't challenged. There are undoubtedly people under bad laws who want to help with ReactOS that can't. Microsoft is not a government poster child.. An antitrust case against you is NOT a reward for good business practices.

Good PR is as much about project developers and project moderators as it is about the public at large or in segments. Any PR campaign that will succeed has to address what the developers and moderators say that is damaging to this project's public image. Leaving threads on this board where someone is attacked personally is not helping.
ReactOS is NOT illegal because of the ways we use to get our information.

Next, who did spit in your face this time? I wont allow another nute war in here, so tell me and we fix this!
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ReactOS is still in alpha stage, meaning it is not feature-complete and is recommended only for evaluation and testing purposes.

okktaviuz
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Re: Public Relations

Post by okktaviuz » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:20 pm

Can i join the PR team?? i can write articles in Bulgarian, Romanian and Russian, also i am very good at photoshop (i don't have a portfolio)
Thanks to the one who started this thread, you are 100% right.

We need to get people know of what reactOS can be, and what is his potential and how we will change the world with it

and stop using OPEN-SOURCE, not everyone is a developer


ReactOS is the biggest threat to Windows, more big than MacOS, Linux, FreeBSD, and OpenStuffOSes took together

I mean it already has a stable kernel, a dev team can implement some kind of different framework on top of it (like android did, without X-server, in our case without Win32), without needing Windows-compatibility stuff, port it on ARM and voila make some kind of application api that are built using HTML5 css javascript webgl and that's all!

wojo664
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Re: Public Relations

Post by wojo664 » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:25 pm

and stop using OPEN-SOURCE
What??

Open source software often comes precompiled (sometimes in many platforms), and You don't have to be a developer. It does not mean that You must compile it Yourself. It means that You can modify (sell, redistribute) it if You want because You have acces to the source code of the program. What's wrong with using O.S. software?

Afterall the whole ReactOS system is Open-Source.... so we can't stop :D

PurpleGurl
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Re: Public Relations

Post by PurpleGurl » Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:38 am

wojo664 wrote:
and stop using OPEN-SOURCE
What??

Open source software often comes precompiled (sometimes in many platforms), and You don't have to be a developer. It does not mean that You must compile it Yourself. It means that You can modify (sell, redistribute) it if You want because You have acces to the source code of the program. What's wrong with using O.S. software?

Afterall the whole ReactOS system is Open-Source.... so we can't stop :D
My guess is that Okktaviuz means not to lead with it being Open Source when trying to win support, lest we alienate the non-coders who want to help. While new developers are good, and we could use more, not everyone can do that. So maybe we should approach different types of people different ways. To get developers, we could approach college students in computer-related classes, maybe even technical schools and community colleges, perhaps even high school students. (Or whatever culturally relevant alternatives exist wherever else in the world.) And we could approach programmers in non-conflicting projects and in technical blogs and magazines.

As for everyone else, we let them know about the features that are in it for them. Basically, we have a rather clean install with a small footprint. We have no commercial interests, and that cuts down on the amount of stuff installed too. We are not trying to get everyone to join "Reactos Messenger Network," push any "online services," and have no interest in a network meeting service that hardly anyone ever uses. Since functionality and efficiency are our main concerns, we probably won't be installing things for which there are better open source alternatives for. I mean, why clone Outlook Express when Thunderbird already exists (and is better in some ways)? So we probably won't include things that people will delete and install something else on top of anyway.

Plus there is the cost factor, as far as the end users are concerned. It is as free as in beer and free as in freedom. Sure, there is a huge cost from our side of the equation. But users won't have to pay $220 USD every few years for a new ReactOS family (or $120 for the OEM version). They will be free to install it on their friends' machines. They won't have to enter serial numbers and get on the web or call anyone to activate. They will be able to upgrade hardware freely, and do the perpetual upgrade thing like a decade or so ago. Now, with Windows the way it is, you are almost forced to replace hardware and the OS at the same time. I mean, if you make more than 3 changes to your computer with Windows, you might not be able to use Windows (generates a new activation hash which doesn't match the one generated when you first built the machine). If you build a totally new system, then you will have to install a new copy of Windows on it. With Reactos, folks will not feel as pressured to replace their PC, since they can replace anything in their system at whim and not have to reactivate Reactos.

Of course, there are caveats when promoting things. We should never spread rumors, promise things we cannot deliver, make accusations, nor attack the alternatives. In other words, we should not refer to Windows as "bloatware," attack Linux (or its users), nor malign the motives of Microsoft. We are not here to attack nor make enemies, but to make an operating system. We don't need to send out any negative vibes. As for the bloatware comment, the more I learn about Reactos, the more respect I have for Microsoft. Anyone bashing the quality of Microsoft's code should take up coding in C and come join us. Most won't do that I am sure. That is about like the saying, "If you don't vote, you have no right to complain about who gets elected." So those who don't code aren't exactly in a position to complain about software and operating systems.

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