February, no 0.3.1...

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nute
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:30 am

February, no 0.3.1...

Post by nute » Fri Feb 02, 2007 3:19 am

Okay, what happened???

There is a newsletter from like the second week of January that is two weeks old explaining why ReactOS 0.3.1 hadn't even been released
by then.

The whole credibility of this project seems to be on the line. Between
an unimaginably catastrophic server failure in December to the word
0.3.1 soon up until the 2nd week of January and now still no 0.3.1
and it's the 1st of February,

Okay, developmental timelines can't be predicted and yes, Murphy's
Law definitely will strike sometimes. And oh yeah, lightning never
strikes the same person twice, three, four, or even a dozen times...

Take the sarcasm as humor and all joking aside, is everything alright
with this project? This is beginning to feel like a real Microsoft project.

We have infrastructure failure, pushed back release dates,...

Avalos
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 3:04 am

Post by Avalos » Fri Feb 02, 2007 3:25 am

I have read that the new version will go out later, why? :S

Z98
Release Engineer
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Post by Z98 » Fri Feb 02, 2007 3:42 am

I guess you've never heard of the Debian project. They can be anywhere from a month to a year behind schedule. Open source projects are inherently less suited to sticking to a schedule, because they don't have external deadlines. All deadlines are self imposed. Considering ROS is still in Alpha, if it misses a release, that's nothing big since it's not really useful for anything beyond testing.

Hope onto the IRC channel. Seriously. There are plenty of commits being reported as well as talk about where a problem is. As well as a bit of teaching. Or just random chatter. But pestering the devs will not get you anywhere. The development infrastructure is well in place. Just because you can't see parts of it doesn't make it bad. The essential parts that are needed by the devs to apply patches, do tests, etc, are all there. Even if the web server goes down, the SVN server and IRC channel remains, and that is where the devs get their work done.

elektrik
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 12:20 am

Re: February, no 0.3.1...

Post by elektrik » Fri Feb 02, 2007 6:04 am

nute wrote:Okay, what happened???

There is a newsletter from like the second week of January that is two weeks old explaining why ReactOS 0.3.1 hadn't even been released
by then.

The whole credibility of this project seems to be on the line. Between
an unimaginably catastrophic server failure in December to the word
0.3.1 soon up until the 2nd week of January and now still no 0.3.1
and it's the 1st of February,

Okay, developmental timelines can't be predicted and yes, Murphy's
Law definitely will strike sometimes. And oh yeah, lightning never
strikes the same person twice, three, four, or even a dozen times...

Take the sarcasm as humor and all joking aside, is everything alright
with this project? This is beginning to feel like a real Microsoft project.

We have infrastructure failure, pushed back release dates,...
Doom! Gloom! The sky is falling! :D

Seriously though, why all the FUD? they (from the land of developers) have said many a time that it will be release when it will be released.....

To paraphrase Oiahim: If you want it faster, contribute somehow.

'nuff said

Apal
Posts: 155
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:13 am
Location: Greece

Post by Apal » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:08 am

Well I saw @ svn rep that a fix was made and 2nd boot stage is not a problem anymore at last!
I think that 0.3.1 is close to be released ;)

EmuandCo
Developer
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Location: Germany, Bavaria, Steinfeld
Contact:

Post by EmuandCo » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:25 am

Maaan, chill. If you need 0.3.1 so badly, build it yourself. We have a nice RosBE for doing so. I vote for releasing a more or less stable trunk Version every two weeks, so everyone has what he wants

GreyGhost
Posts: 295
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:16 pm

Post by GreyGhost » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:37 am

OK ... there remain two choises...
1- Give out a build with many regressions and bugs..
2- spend some time fixing bugs and then release..

obviously the second one is better for the image of the project...
And last time i checked (yesterday..) the IRC topc read that mahjor bugs have been fixed and 0.3.1 maybe expected soon ...
Regards GreyGhost

GreatLord
Developer
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Location: Sweden

Post by GreatLord » Fri Feb 02, 2007 9:26 am

when we start doing release process of 0.3.1 it have allot issue and regress thanks to ungoinh rewriting of part in ntoskrnl. it cause allot of regress, and we need fix thuse regress to getting thing to work. after that
we need check everthing what have regress and not regress after fixing ntoskrnl regress. It is not easy thing todo.

when u decide doing a release when ungoing rewrite of ntoskrnl it cause allot of problem. what I can see in 0.3.1 branch it is 2-3 regress that are need to be fixed before we can see if we got other regress.

here is some example
1. For vmware and real hardware :
Some thing is wrong when u try going into graphice mode with vbe drv
ntoskrnl/ke/trap.s line 1559 unlanging code patch, we have add new
crash handling code, that are not finish yet. we need this be fixed in
trunk and 0.3.1

2. SSE does not working at moment, the fpu is back and working again
both in 0.3.1 and the trunk. (maybe will not be fix in 0.3.1)

it exists some other regress that we need fix as well

digiboy
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:47 am

SVN ISOs

Post by digiboy » Fri Feb 02, 2007 4:55 pm

If you want, just download the SVN ISOs. The SVN server builds a complete ISO everytime a patch is commited.

http://svn.reactos.org/iso?M=D

The M=D will sort by date.

If you watch the CIA website you can track the patches that are still being applied to the 0.3.1 version as we speak.

http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/ReactOS

So watch these sites and know what's going on.

A few weeks ago the 0.3.1 branch was trashed and they created a new branch with all the lastest patches.

If they are going to go thru the hassle of releasing this on SF.NET they want to make sure it's 'better' than the last release.

Enjoy

nute
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:30 am

Post by nute » Fri Feb 02, 2007 11:23 pm

Why is it harder for open source projects to meet deadlines and what
is the true purpose of this web site?

1) Okay, limited developers.

2) Becoming compatability with a black box without duplicating it, fun ;-)

3) I'd say money, but it looks like the fundraiser is going fairly well.

Seriously though, isn't the bazaar a better model for development than
the cathedral model as far as speed and level of innovation?

We get a new version of Microsoft Windows about every 7 years. This
project is in it's eleventh year and though it might be hard to get the first
compatible system out I hope development accelerates soon.

oiaohm
Posts: 1322
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:40 am

Post by oiaohm » Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:52 am

Bazaar is normally faster.

If the bazaar is broken it effects a lots of the coders. Not all developers work in kernel. If kernel does not work they cannot test there patchs. This could be driver codes or graphical interface programmers.

Lots of the development have been slowed by lack of documentation or incorrect documentation. The faults in the kernel have been caused by both. I hope this is the last major kernel rehash. To be Correct a new version of Windows by Microsofts own rules is ment to be every 2 to 3 years. Lets just say Vista was majorly over due. Its first release date was 2005. On top of that they have the complete internal specs and can throw large amounts of money at problem. So they should have been able to hit there dead lines.

Everything should speed up a bit when kernel is working.

frik85
Developer
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Contact:

Post by frik85 » Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:01 am

nute wrote:3) I'd say money, but it looks like the fundraiser is going fairly well.
Please read the paragraph "What will this money be used for?" on this page:
http://www.reactos.org/en/fundraising_campaign.html

florian
Posts: 453
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Location: Germany

Post by florian » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:59 pm

nute wrote: 1) Okay, limited developers.

[...]

This project is in it's eleventh year and though it might be hard to get the first compatible system out I hope development accelerates soon.
Limited developers with limited time plus an ongoing audit.

And please be aware that ReactOS originally was called FreeWin95. Read the following part of Wikipedia:

"Around 1996, a group of open source developers started a project called FreeWin95, with the aim of implementing an operating system that would be a clone of Windows 95. The project stalled in discussions of the design of the system.

At the end of 1997, the project had yet to release any software. The project members, led by coordinator Jason Filby, called to revive the project. The project's target was changed to Windows NT and the project's name was changed to ReactOS. The ReactOS project began in February 1998, with developing the kernel and basic drivers."

Therefore the time of effective development is probably a little bit shorter. Let's say nine years. But of course we all hope for accelerated developement.

Mrkaras
Posts: 379
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Location: Australia
Contact:

Post by Mrkaras » Sun Feb 04, 2007 10:18 am

reactos always makes early predictions of releases, the range from slightly late to very late. the prediction to have a beta 0.5 version by 2008 sounds good but I won't be surprised if it doesn't make it. there have always been (and perhaps always will be) not enough developers but the point is not hat it is too slow but that the newsletter said that it will be out on this date then that is will be out on another date, but both have passed.

this probably sounds like I am really annoyed with the situation but that is not the case, don't take it that way, just stating my observations.

EmuandCo
Developer
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Post by EmuandCo » Sun Feb 04, 2007 10:36 pm

Be aware that the Kernel itself was pushed to a almost Beta Stadium already (Alex ftw). The rest will come too. It will come to 0.5 in 2008. I am a believer

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