Is ReactOS planned to be able to play games?

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reub2000
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Is ReactOS planned to be able to play games?

Post by reub2000 » Mon Jan 31, 2005 3:50 am

In the future, is it planned that ROS will be able to play games? Not games like Solitary or Minesweeper, but games like Half-Life 2 or Unreal Tournament 2004. And play them with full speed and full effects like when they run nativly.

bratao
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Post by bratao » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:04 am

we need something like directx to run at good speed, but the Yes, our plan is run all :D

reub2000
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Post by reub2000 » Mon Jan 31, 2005 5:51 am

bratao wrote:we need something like directx to run at good speed, but the Yes, our plan is run all :D
Since ROS uses wine for it's APIs, why not use the wine fork cedega for directx.

SirTalon
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Post by SirTalon » Mon Jan 31, 2005 6:20 am

1. Cedega is under the LGPL, not the GPL
2. Cedega's code that allows some games to run (like the copy protection stuff) is under the Aladin Public License.
3. Cedega's DirectX simply translates the calls into OpenGL calls.
4. OpenGL on Windows does the opposite, it translate the calls to DirectX calls.

I don't remember if LGPL code can be used in GPL programs (if so then ignore point 1). I'm also not sure if Windows CD-Rom drivers would make #2 a moot point either.

It would seem that either Linux's OpenGL libraries would have to be ported to ROS, or written from scratch. If 1 is ignored, then it should be rather simple to write a DirectX replacement (possibly as easy as copy and pasting huge parts of the code in places).

uniQ
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Post by uniQ » Mon Jan 31, 2005 7:36 am

SirTalon wrote:I don't remember if LGPL code can be used in GPL programs
Yea, because ROS (GPL) uses Wine code (LGPL).

-uniQ
Coming on, coming up, let me help ROS and I'll be able to look @ a life well used.

navaraf
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Post by navaraf » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:37 am

SirTalon wrote:1. Cedega is under the LGPL, not the GPL
This is not a problem at all...
SirTalon wrote:2. Cedega's code that allows some games to run (like the copy protection stuff) is under the Aladin Public License.
The whole Cedega's DirectX stuff is under Aladin Public License.
SirTalon wrote:4. OpenGL on Windows does the opposite, it translate the calls to DirectX calls.
This isn't correct. There normal OpenGL drivers on Windows and no translation to DirectX calls is done. We already support basic OpenGL in ReactOS.

5. Both Wine's and Cedega's implementation is tied to Linux and it wouldn't be easy to remove the dependancy.

Furthermore, we DON'T want to use any Direct3D->OpenGL wrapper in ROS. Doing a proper hardware accelerated Direct3D isn't as hard as it might seem, I would even say that it's easier than porting the Wine Direct3D stuff...

Gasmann
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Post by Gasmann » Mon Jan 31, 2005 2:45 pm

navaraf wrote:This isn't correct. There normal OpenGL drivers on Windows and no translation to DirectX calls is done.
That's right and you can see it when you're using WinNT... no DirectX is available for it, but OpenGL works without any problems in NT.

reub2000
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Post by reub2000 » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:15 pm

I installed StarCraft in ros downloaded from reactsoft, running on qemu. I selected to install DX5, but it said that NT already had DX and wouldn't install it. So are you sure NT does not have DX? (SC claimed there was no CD in the CD drive, so I couldn't tell if it wouldn't run.)

Since newer versions of DX can be installed on Windows, why not install these in ros?

nothin2g
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Post by nothin2g » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:21 pm

AFAIK it is not legal to install DX without owning a licensed copy of windows.
(but having the possibility to install it would be great :-)
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reub2000
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Post by reub2000 » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:29 pm

nothin2g wrote:AFAIK it is not legal to install DX without owning a licensed copy of windows.
(but having the possibility to install it would be great :-)
So basicly ros could make it so that it works, but not package it with ros, so ros would stay legal. But the user could break the eula if they wanted by downloading and installing it. It would be much harder for the BSA to go after individual users who are using an unlicenced copy of DirectX, which is free.

cuppm
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Post by cuppm » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:48 pm

reub2000 wrote:DirectX, which is free.
It's only free when used on a qualifying Windows system. So wouldn't that mean if you install it on ROS, then you would be required to own a Windows lisence (which isn't free)?

mf
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Post by mf » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:51 pm

reub2000 wrote:So basicly ros could make it so that it works, but not package it with ros, so ros would stay legal. But the user could break the eula if they wanted by downloading and installing it. It would be much harder for the BSA to go after individual users who are using an unlicenced copy of DirectX, which is free.
Not to mention if you took it to European court (don't know about American) they'd void the EULA for being anticompetitive. Disallowing the use of something with a compatible alternative is a BIG no-no when it comes to monopoly stuff. That's why here in NL, coffee companies other than Douwe Egberts (which has the original deal with Philips) can sell their Senseo-Crema compatible coffee pads without being sued ;).

Gasmann
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Post by Gasmann » Mon Jan 31, 2005 4:53 pm

reub2000 wrote:So are you sure NT does not have DX?
Well, there are some unofficial releases of DirectX 5 and 6 for Windows NT, but nothing official I think.

Baldomero
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Post by Baldomero » Mon Jan 31, 2005 8:23 pm

reub2000 wrote:
So basicly ros could make it so that it works, but not package it with ros, so ros would stay legal. But the user could break the eula if they wanted by downloading and installing it. It would be much harder for the BSA to go after individual users who are using an unlicenced copy of DirectX, which is free.
I'm with this idea. ReactOS should not suffer the consequences of monopoly, that is playing wthin the legal rules. Is ilegall make ReactOS compatible and able to install this software? If not, then the user is the one responsible of installing it.

On the other side, if someone needs a computer with DirectX, and also needs it to be legal (for example, a cibercoffee), it could be just double work for programmers: one, make directx installable on ReactOS, and two, make an legall and free alternative to DirectX running on ReactOS for those who need a legal working copy of ReactOS with DirectX support.

uniQ
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Post by uniQ » Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:04 pm

mf wrote:Not to mention if you took it to European court (don't know about American) they'd void the EULA for being anticompetitive..
(Sorry, I can't resist this)

IN AMERICAN COURT, EULA VOIDS YOU!!

-uniQ

PS. Well, they'd *very* likely uphold the EULA.
Coming on, coming up, let me help ROS and I'll be able to look @ a life well used.

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