The one killer app missing from React OS

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bcmike
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The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by bcmike »

Hi Everyone. First time, long time.

I'm not sure if the React OS stewards are looking for heavy adaption just yet as they promote the software as Alpha (a decades old status), but react OS could gain massive adoption right now as in today if they would just do one thing;

Develop an RDP server for React OS.

I know this is no trivial thing but Microsoft opened up the spec years ago and the Linux community has developed its own RDP server for X, so it's not impossible. Developing an RDP server for React OS would give the open source community at large a light weight win32/64 platform available for virtual applications. This means multiple license free VDI use cases become available to administrator's. Also with an integrated rdp server you can now stop developing the HAL for compatibility with thousands of drivers and a myriad of low level hardware and simply develop for the most popular hypervisors.

Imagine this; a super light Linux distro that simply boots, runs KVM and then starts a React OS vm and an rdp client. At this point the hypervisor is the HAL. Now imagine React OS runs all the O365 apps seamlessly. You now have a license free business platform for running all your necessary productivity apps which can be run from the DC or in a decentralized fashion as described previously. There are plenty of open source LDAP solutions for providing directory services that could also be integrated.

To be honest I'm not sure Microsoft even wants to be in the desktop space anymore and they make most of their revenue from cloud services and o365 now. This is a niche that react OS could jump right into and enjoy a good deal of success.

Also a note here, VNC and all of its derivatives just aren't good enough, period full stop.. I won't debate this.

I've been coming here for years, looking for any progress on a RDP server but there's been not even a hint of this as a priority, too bad it could be a game changer. If ever it was to come to pass that React released a version with RDP remote access, I'd be deploying it in minutes.
feldrim
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by feldrim »

I am not sure if I would like to RDP to a machine that does not work stable, cannot run many usable apps and pops BSOD out of nowhere. So yeah, I guess I can get it why it's not one of the top priorities.
bcmike
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by bcmike »

feldrim wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 1:15 am I am not sure if I would like to RDP to a machine that does not work stable, cannot run many usable apps and pops BSOD out of nowhere. So yeah, I guess I can get it why it's not one of the top priorities.
I guess I gave React too much credit then. At some point though someone's going to have to make a use case for the project. Right now it's an educational project.
feldrim
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by feldrim »

Well, it'd in Alpha state. Like you, I have been following the project for years. However, I haven't contributed the project too. Windows NT had 1400 engineers back in time, while ReactOS has 20 volunteers at most.

The ideas are good. But you know what's better? Contribution. Either testing, debugging, developing, etc. If none, well, you can send some donations.

It's an open source project and roadmap is designed by the community. The effort is limited by the quality and the quantity of the community. Of you are a developer, and plan to reimplement Windows Remote Desktop Services API (formerly the Terminal Services API), that's great news! Otherwise, there is a lot of work to do currently that needs to be done beforehand.
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binarymaster
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by binarymaster »

bcmike wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 1:03 am Develop an RDP server for React OS.
First of all, ReactOS is written in one word. Please remember that and edit your post(s).

Second, the RDP server, or also known as Terminal Services, does exist as idea for GSoC for years already (you can straight open the GSoC ideas pages on wiki for all years to check it), but nobody wants to work on it.

https://reactos.org/wiki/Google_Summer_ ... l_Services
https://reactos.org/wiki/Google_Summer_ ... l_Services
https://reactos.org/wiki/Google_Summer_ ... l_Services

and etc.
bcmike
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by bcmike »

Wow, defensive group. I thought the category mentioned feedback in its title. I also think I said it would be no trivial thing to develop an RDP server for ReactOS. And yes NT had 1400 engineers, but it also had to be all things to all people with a lot of server components like routing and RAS, IIS, etc, etc. What I'm getting at is that by developing an RDP server and focusing on hypervisor integration you won't have to develop for a million different platforms and use cases. Focus on VDI and work your way out.

Believe me if I had a few hundred K sitting around I'd fork this and go for it but I don't. I'm just putting the idea out there in case someone wants to run with it, I'm not saying someone has to run with it. I also know there's a lot of users out there like me that could use the product I've described.
learn_more
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by learn_more »

bcmike wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:48 am Wow, defensive group. I thought the category mentioned feedback in its title.
Well, that happens if a lot of people weight in on what we should do,
instead of helping us doing it :)

We don't lack ideas of what to work on, we lack people working on ideas.
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dizt3mp3r
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by dizt3mp3r »

That wasn't defence. That was simply stating the situation as it is. If you want to see us in defence just say something indefensible and completely wrong and target our dear OS.

We are just putting you on track with regard to ReactOS and its capabilities as of now. Don't take it personally.

One thing the world is full of, is good ideas and we do get a lot of them here... Conversely and unfortunately the world is not full of Windows kernel and o/s developers. If you have suitable programming skills we would ask you to donate them.
Skillset: VMS,DOS,Windows Sysadmin from 1985, fault-tolerance, VaxCluster, Alpha,Sparc. DCL,QB,VBDOS- VB6,.NET, PHP,NODE.JS, Graphic Design, Project Manager, CMS, Quad Electronics. classic cars & m'bikes. Artist in water & oils. Historian.
bcmike
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by bcmike »

dizt3mp3r wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 7:37 pm We are just putting you on track with regard to ReactOS and its capabilities as of now. Don't take it personally.

One thing the world is full of, is good ideas and we do get a lot of them here... Conversely and unfortunately the world is not full of Windows kernel and o/s developers. If you have suitable programming skills we would ask you to donate them.
Unfortunately I do not possess the skills you described or I most likely would get to work right now, I'm simply coming at this from a consumer point of view and describing what I would see as an exciting use case. I guess it's a bit of chicken and egg, perhaps if more of the industry at large could see a potential use case for ReactOS in their enterprise you would attract more volunteer developers?

I assure everyone that I am not taking any of this conversation personally, I'm just disappointed at the negativity and lack of vision. I get it though, the project is struggling to get past Alpha and someone shows up with a lofty suggestion. Maybe in the future just pat the next guy on the head and politely say sorry too busy right now.
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dizt3mp3r
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by dizt3mp3r »

There is no negativity other than that you bring/perceive. Lack of vision is not anything the team can be accused of just because your idea is not received with massive applause... They already have a vision that they daily strive towards, that is an XP/2003 compatible open source o/s, one that works - and until that happens, anything else is largely superfluous.

It isn't that the team is struggling to get beyond Alpha. The team is making steady progress and if you want faster progress, learn to code or donate. That is simply how it is. I cannot code in C. I contribute with an occasional donation when I can, some documentation every now and then and answering questions here clearly. All concrete assistance helps, ideas on usage at this point, less so.

The main problem here is having to reset expectations for people that have theirs set too high as they haven't fully done their research. We've all been there, so don't cut yourself up about it.

No-one is going to politely do the final thing you suggest. They will simply tell you the truth, truth is sometimes painful and you'll learn to take it. No impoliteness meant or implied by stating the truth.
Skillset: VMS,DOS,Windows Sysadmin from 1985, fault-tolerance, VaxCluster, Alpha,Sparc. DCL,QB,VBDOS- VB6,.NET, PHP,NODE.JS, Graphic Design, Project Manager, CMS, Quad Electronics. classic cars & m'bikes. Artist in water & oils. Historian.
bcmike
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by bcmike »

The truth as I perceive it is that no one is interested in developing an RDP server. That's fair and not "painful" except for the process that it took to get there. It was also disappointing that no one wanted to debate the merits of such a proposal even if nobody wants to put it on the roadmap tomorrow.

I will also cede all comments above as fair, except one. ReactOS is indeed struggling to get out of Alpha as its been in Alpha for well over a decade. My join date in Nov 05 2008 and ReactOS was already well under way. Within that context I would say struggling to get out of Alpha is fair comment. I sincerely hope that you are close to achieving your goals and I will be watching earnestly hoping you succeed.
Julcar
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by Julcar »

With this project I learned a very important thing: if you want something, you have two options, one is wait until it is done, and the second is do it yourself, or at least make the task as easy as possible, so the wait is shorter.

I've helped to fix several bugs by sending debug logs, by describing misbehaviors, and recently by inspecting the source code.

The easiest task you could do is to find software that already does what you want, test it if it supports windows xp, if it is open source then try to understand its code, you don't need to be a programmer to do that, indeed you are gonna learn a lot in the process, and then, you might be able to make more easy the task by telling us what is failing and how should work.
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dizt3mp3r
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by dizt3mp3r »

"No one is interested in developing an RDP server" - probably quite right but the way you are putting it here, it seems more like "nobody is interested in MY suggestion". The reason that no one is interested in developing an RDP server is simply this - because the o/s is not finished, nowhere near finished and it makes no sense at all for anyone to start doing something that would be useless to everyone at this point in time.

It is only struggling to get out of Alpha if the engineers are trying desperately to get to beta, they aren't. They know that leaving Alpha is a huge task and will possibly take years yet. They just put their heads down and work on the problem in front of them, no need to struggle toward that particular goal as it is currently unattainable.

We need to stop talking to you now so that we can get on and do other things. If you have nothing more creative nor argumentative to offer then I intend to do something else, so should you. No need to respond further on this topic.

By all means test software that meets your requirements on ReactOS. In the time that ReactOS will take to complete, you could probably learn C programming and implement an RDP server yourself.
Skillset: VMS,DOS,Windows Sysadmin from 1985, fault-tolerance, VaxCluster, Alpha,Sparc. DCL,QB,VBDOS- VB6,.NET, PHP,NODE.JS, Graphic Design, Project Manager, CMS, Quad Electronics. classic cars & m'bikes. Artist in water & oils. Historian.
Aeneas
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by Aeneas »

I do not think you should say, "will take years", my dear dizt3mp3r. That would be unfairly rushing the project.

We should aim for centuries... millennia perhaps... :lol: (Indeed, had it been started at the times of our Saviour, it would be presently nigh useable... in Latin and Aramaic, but still... a pity such foresight lacked! Yet again, there is nothing to hurry.)
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EmuandCo
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Re: The one killer app missing from React OS

Post by EmuandCo »

Do I smell some sarcasm here?
ReactOS is still in alpha stage, meaning it is not feature-complete and is recommended only for evaluation and testing purposes.

If my post/reply offends or insults you, be sure that you know what sarcasm is...
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