Package Manager

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meij
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Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:16 am

Post by meij »

heres a few ideas / thoughts that have been running through my head while reading this thread

1) Files should be able to be downloaded from official sites (or mirrors) if required. firstly this might be a legal requirement and secondly why mirror for example the whole sf.net archive you can just directly download from. I know you might want everything in neat little zips yada yada, but its not practical.
2) C/C++ is a must, speed + portablility.
3) Keep the dependancys minimal. This might become a little problem when you start getting files in some not-so-common formats (eg: 7zip), though you could easily get around this by being able to assign package dependancys for any package. I would probably make a base package with a fair few command line apps like unzip, unrar etc..
4) due to the way installs are done on windows i would probably try and think of this as more of an 'Application Installer' because if you add packages that have an .exe installer you could run into some problems (say the user chooses an install destination other than the original). that said, theres nothing stopping you from making custom uninstallers for things that lack them.
5) Link it with Add/Remove programs
6) Try and figure out all limitations before you implement it. Nothing worse than recoding half the thing due to a design oversight.

frik85
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Post by frik85 »

Dr. Fred wrote:I've created another version. Hope you like it.
Good idea!

Harteex
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Post by Harteex »

Dr. Fred wrote:I thought it could work like iTunes or Mozilla Thunderbird you just enter something and it starts to select.
Ah ok, that sounds good
Dr. Fred wrote:I should have explained it a bit more. The Action is just for the actual program: You choose a program from the tree and then choose a action. You can also check the checkbox then the "install" and for installed programs "update". For Freeware the "install from src" checkbox is just disabled.
Double click might also change the action and right click show a context menu.
ok.
The "Windows way" of adding packages from cd is to check a box. If the app is already installed you can uncheck it to uninstall.

Just to brainstorm a little... an alternative way of handling this, in a more windows way, could be to have two trees. One with Binaries and one with sources. When you click the radio button for sources, the tree changes automaticly to the source tree.

NetSlayer
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Post by NetSlayer »

I don't think we should provide software that is not GPL'd. We should keep it all clean.

Also, most GLP'd software is available from sf.net and that's a BIG advantage for us: the user can choose from many mirrors and we don't need server power and nevertheless we have high speed downloads to offer.

Like a sf.net GUI frontend for Windows/ReactOS apps.

frik85
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Post by frik85 »

Dr. Fred wrote:I thought it could work like iTunes or Mozilla Thunderbird you just enter something and it starts to select.
iTunes, Thunderbirdand Nero (Burning Rom) have a very good user interface.
Harteex wrote:The "Windows way" of adding packages from cd is to check a box. If the app is already installed you can uncheck it to uninstall.
:arrow: office 2k install gui (select packets)

meij
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:16 am

Post by meij »

NetSlayer wrote:I don't think we should provide software that is not GPL'd. We should keep it all clean.
should probably provide any OSI approved liceneced software, possibly some freeware (NetStumbler > *). Only GPL's pretty restrictive.

Gedi

Post by Gedi »

meij wrote:2) C/C++ is a must, speed + portablility.
My thoughts exactly. This goes for pretty much any project IMO.

If ROS wants to compete with windows, It'll need it's speed, after all not all machines have 3Gb processors. Higher level lanuages such as Delphi and VB are great for what they were intended for, but for serious programming C is a must.

Dr. Fred
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Location: Amsterdam

Post by Dr. Fred »

Harteex wrote:The "Windows way" of adding packages from cd is to check a box. If the app is already installed you can uncheck it to uninstall.
We could do that if, we would have just 2 options, but we have 4. So maybe checkboxes aren't the best idea and we should use another feature of the tree view instead: icons. Same thing, but with one icon for each action.

If you click once one the icon it installs, the second time it installs from src....

PS: Here is the link to the wiki again for those who don't want to read everything here.
http://mok.lvcm.com/cgi-bin/reactos/ros ... ageManager
Where do you want ReactOS to go today ?

tgc
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Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2004 10:50 pm
Location: DK

Post by tgc »

I was just wondering if this application/packages manager only is for managing 3. party software, or if it also will be able to update ReactOS, so that it wont be needed to reinstall everytime there is a new release?

BTW, just to give my 0.02€, i think it's overkill, and way too much trouble, to repack programs for this manager, just let the manager download the application and start the install program if available.

Dr. Fred
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Post by Dr. Fred »

tgc wrote:I was just wondering if this application/packages manager only is for managing 3. party software, or if it also will be able to update ReactOS, so that it wont be needed to reinstall everytime there is a new release?
Of cause it could be used to update ros, too. Someone just has to write a script for it. But I had to update the registry, too. I don't know how this should work.
tgc wrote:Files should be able to be downloaded from official sites (or mirrors)
We wanted to do it like this. Not because of legal problems, but because we just don't have the bandwhich.
due to the way installs are done on windows i would probably try and think of this as more of an 'Application Installer' because if you add packages that have an .exe installer you could run into some problems (say the user chooses an install destination other than the original).
I used to have a tool from Norton on my Pc. I don't remember the name, something with clean. Always when you installed a program it recorded all changes. We could code sth. similar to that. But the main feature are first.
Where do you want ReactOS to go today ?

Sami
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Portage (Gentoo -linux)

Post by Sami »

Will Package manager install programs with some kind of default settings,
or will it pop up all the dialogs or message boxes? When I want to install
several programs there could be tens of messages poping and asking this
and that. How would this be handled?

You may also want to check how Gentoo -Linux is handling things. Their
Package manager is called Portage and emerge is the name of command line
command. It is working something like this.

Installing new program:

Code: Select all

emerge program
Update all the installed programs:

Code: Select all

emerge world
Update all system files (update OS):

Code: Select all

emerge system
There is also many GUI -projects for Portage. You may want to check them out.


links:
Gentoo Linux:
www.gentoo.org

Portage introduction:
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/h ... t=2&chap=1

Gentoo linux forums (very active, may be useful for more information):
http://forums.gentoo.org/

Portagemaster (GUI):
http://portagemaster.sourceforge.net/

Porthole (another GUI):
http://porthole.sourceforge.net/

...more guis:
http://packages.gentoo.org/packages/?ca ... pp-portage

meij
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:16 am

Post by meij »

On the wiki you say all the package info will be stored in one file. You should probably split it up so its 1 file per package to take advantage of svn (check out rsync aswell, gentoo uses this for portage) so it'll only update what it needs to rather than updating the whole tree file whenever theres a change. this would also make adding, editing and removing much easier.

meij
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 2:16 am

Re: Portage (Gentoo -linux)

Post by meij »

Sami wrote:Will Package manager install programs with some kind of default settings,
or will it pop up all the dialogs or message boxes? When I want to install
several programs there could be tens of messages poping and asking this
and that. How would this be handled?
It'll probably have to be more of a central install point rather than a 'Package manager', It should just download the files, and (if theres an installer) run the .exe and thats about it (possibly create a custom uninstaller if need be). Thats assuming people dont want to compile the apps.

Im wondering how there going to manage compiling applications from source. Most applications for windows are made using Visual Studio which isnt always compatible with MinGW.

I think the whole lot of you need to jump onto IRC and have a brain storm on what you need / want from this app and work from there.

Dr. Fred
Developer
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:09 pm
Location: Amsterdam

Post by Dr. Fred »

@Sami
I like the Porthole GUI and I like the idea of creating different tabs for the description.
When I want to install several programs there could be tens of messages poping and asking this and that. How would this be handled?
We want as less user interaction as possible.
On the wiki you say all the package info will be stored in one file.
I only meant the information the program needs for browsing.
Most applications for windows are made using Visual Studio which isnt always compatible with MinGW.
Lots of projects provide makefiles, too. I think we can handle that somehow.
Where do you want ReactOS to go today ?

Dr. Fred
Developer
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:09 pm
Location: Amsterdam

Post by Dr. Fred »

However I think time has come to decide on the script-file system. I vote for my suggestion, coding our own batch file like script lang. if we are implementing advanced stuff, like "if"-statements we can go the VB way.

Other options could be, using msi files or an installer like Nsis or using a xml based one. If many people want something like that or something else, I will set up a pool in this forum.
Where do you want ReactOS to go today ?

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