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Ewie GUI

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 12:12 am
by Murmur
On the indiegogo page it state that "A newly rewritten User Interface (no Metro - we promise!)" and as much as I understand why ROS would say that phrase in that manor I also think it shows shortsightedness of the overall picture.

First and foremost I want to get to the root of the problem, Metro. Metro is not bad, it was just awfully implemented by Microsoft.

Microsoft forced us to use metro and took away the ability to use the standard desktop effectively. We were forced to rely on hacks to the system or force us to decrease productivity which ended up angering their client base. Even though the implementation was bad the functionality for what Metro was aiming for was good. Metro is a touch interface for tablets, touchscreen, phones etc and it does that well and even though it will still need additional functionality, it is in the right direction.

Now what can ReactOS learn from it? Well for starters is that by stating "no Metro" you are basically stating no touch interface. I think that actually adding an interface (after you get the explorer-new working ofc) similar to metro would only improve things but with one huge difference from how MS implemented theirs. Give the user an OPTION to use it or not. This will be important in the future when ROS start trying to move to embedded devices.

Re: Ewie GUI

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:12 am
by vicmarcal
Well, just to clear a bit, the "No Metro, we promise!" should be seen as a "funny" point, not as a "wide" criticism against Metro.
Now, imho, Metro for Desktop/Laptops, which doesn't have touch screen, is a total horrible decission. Metro and Desktop/Laptops just don't fit.

I still remember one of the first questions of the book written by one of the developers of the first Windows Explorer. The question was:
-Why did you place a button called "Start"?
The answer is pretty simple:
- We thought that any new user reaching desktop for his first time needed a "hint" to know "what to do" when the desktop was shown to them. And calling a button "Start" was a pretty cool "hit me!" hint.

During the following years, Windows users got used to the "Start" button to such level that Microsoft deleted the word "Start" and just kept "the Button". Users, kept pressing the button because it was placed in the exactly same place where all the old ones were. Probably some doesn't even remember that there was a "Start" string in the first Windows explorer versions.

If Microsoft would have deleted the "Start" string, and placed the button to a total different place, probably the users would have hit the same problem they are hitting with current Windows Metro interface.
But Metro interface is even worse, because it is absolutly new,it works different and it lacks the "hint". That's the reason Microsoft added again the Start button, and adding the Start button is the proof of their usability failure.

And from a global pov:
When you try to create an unique solution for Desktop and Tablets, you end with a product which doesn't fit Desktop 100% neither Tablets 100%.
Yeah, it cuts development costs but the solution won't fit perfectly both kind of products. This is an engineering law. And the mass demanded a button.

If the Metro implementation is wrong as it is now, then Metro is wrong.
Could it be more user friendly and even more powerful? Sure. But then, it wouldnt be Metro but another thing.Call it: Tram.

Re: Ewie GUI

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:22 am
by Murmur
Don't get me wrong I am not a metro lover and I agree with all your points. Lately I have been using a touchscreen laptop (Because the touchpad is soooo bad on this laptop) and doing business as usually on classic shell is difficult but on the same page using metro kinda got in the way because a lot of the stuff I needed to do was on the desktop. I hope to see a bridge between these two and hopefully MS will get their act together in the next release and redesign their interface enough to make it work / interchangeable.

Re: Ewie GUI

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 10:04 am
by Black_Fox
Murmur wrote:I hope to see a bridge between these two
Until there's an official bridge, you might see StartIsBack+ (press WIN =>Start Menu, press Ctrl+WIN => Start Screen).