Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

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Witch
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Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Mon Sep 07, 2009 11:25 pm

1.) Which universities for each country in the world produces qualified OS developers?

Example:
Country: USA
Major: Not sure how things work in the US?

Course: http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-En ... /index.htm

Prerequisites: C, 6.033, and 6.170 (and, by implication, 6.004)

Who should take 6.828?
seniors and MEng students, PhD students are also welcome ....
I thought that if ReactOS could list all the places in the world. Where brand new OS devs are most likely to emerge. Then the chances of intercepting them before Microsoft does will be more effective. And if Microsoft wants to play this game with us then they will have to hire every fresh baked OS developer in the world. In order to prevent the ReactOS pendulum movements.

I mean Microsoft is rich but they can't be that rich, right? :)

Also mapping all the places where OS devs are most likely to emerge. Can help ReactOS connect all the relevant universities together for some Competition games or Collaboration games. Whatever the current devs thinks will be most helpful in promoting ReactOS the most efficient around the world. Universities loves competition I've heard :)

Ged
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Ged » Mon Sep 07, 2009 11:53 pm

None, you can't rely on universities to teach you.
If you're serious about developing operating systems then you teach yourself.

Generally, good kernel devs are normally very skilled programmers a long time before they're old enough to go to university.
The ones that aren't have a natural skill and a desire to learn.

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Post by hto » Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:37 am

IIRC, Fireball already tried to advertise ReactOS in his Alma Mater.

Witch
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:41 pm

Ged wrote: Generally, good kernel devs are normally very skilled programmers a long time before they're old enough to go to university.
The ones that aren't have a natural skill and a desire to learn.
Oh noes strike one. :(


....or wait can't ReactOS create an online "Teach yourself OS developing in 24 hours" crash course university using youtube? :)
You know for the purpose of streamlining the learning curve for would be OS devs in the future.

vicmarcal
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by vicmarcal » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:48 am

Or better, we can sell them to Microsoft after done and with some of the moeny collected we will pay for developing ReactOS.
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:01 pm

Well I don't know how many soccer/football fans there are here but as an example. Look at Barcelona FC (football club) one of the most stable and fun to watch teams in European football. What I've heard they have their own football academy where they train new talents.

That's why (to my eyes) it looks like they have a 100 competent players. It doesn't matter if 10 of the team's superstars get injured or die. It seems like anybody on their bench or rookies from the academy can replace whatever superstar they have.

With the above analogy ReactOS should also have their own academy of trainees. So the Project coordinator doesn't have to comb the face of the earth for superstar talents it's very time consuming and difficult. Instead plant some seeds in your backyard and pick from them when the old team is planning to retire after 10-30 years.



ignore this link. I bookmarked it here for my memory also for further investigation by asking around.

vicmarcal
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by vicmarcal » Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:08 pm

I think it will be easier creating a Plan with some Universities who wants to join it.
Each student has to do a final work before going outside the University, these works are supervised by the Teachers.Maybe we can try to find agreements(as other Projects,Companies does) with these Universities in small jobs as: Finding and solving some Bugs in ReactOS APIS, Improving current code,etc..maybe not big internal tasks but this approach can help, and who knows, maybe some of these students will continue helping after doing this Final work. Also it will make us present in the IT Universities(which means advertisement) which can lead to others bigger arrangements.
The work of these students could be followed via ReactOS CIA commits(they will have their own branches) and via Iserv and via Mailing List(as we do currently with any "odd" commit by actual developers).When the student ends the work, ReactOS Foundation just have to evaluate the final work and give the results to the Teacher.Evaluate is just Passed or Failed.Not much work at all.
This is the best approach imo, since creating a place where teaching people is eutopic nowadays, we dont have enough manpower for it, neither our devs have time to do it, and it will kidnap developing time and we need every minute of developing.
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:54 am

Yeah! :mrgreen: Does anybody have good connections with a MIT os dev teacher? Because universities around the world envy MIT they have a coca-cola formula that few to none have been able to copy.

MIT in my eyes is the top of the pyramid make it there, then everything else will automatically fall in place with little effort around the world. There might be another Skywalker (university) in the US, but I'm not familiar with US culture so some american will have to filter out the right Skywalker. mmmkay...

vicmarcal
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by vicmarcal » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:12 am

Well, I was thinking about nearer places.As Fireball did in Russia, everyone of us has came from IT Universities or there were IT Universities near our homes.
Maybe ReactOS Foundation can try to get in contact with different Universities to join this Plan, we dont need a lot of Universities, just 3 or 4 in all the world which can develop different ReactOS areas.If after the first year this Plan is working, we can spread to 5 or 6...and so on.Or just delete the Plan. MIT?Well..maybe MIT is quite far away from our possibilities, but right now i would be proud of having a Russian University, a British University or any Spanish University...Any work is wellcome ;)
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Witch
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:10 pm

So what's the next step at this very moment? Do we just fill out an ReactOS foundation application form.
Send it away and wait for a thumbs-up or thumbs-down sign from the gods upstairs. Or what needs to be done from here on?

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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by vicmarcal » Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:53 am

The very first step is to concrete a Plan, which has to be validated by the Foundation.
Usually a Plan means more than 10 papers where everything is complete defined.Starting with the Objetives, the Universities,how are we going to control the results,which are the advantages for the University, which are the advantages for the foundation,which tools are we going to provide,etc. That Plan has to be approved by the Foundation and after that we can try to find Universities which wants to be part of it.
Remember 3 or 4 main points:
*ReactOS Foundation doesnt have money to invest
*ReactOS Foundation doesnt have Developers to follow daily the advances of the students
*The plan has to be well written to convince Universities

I have some ideas in the brain..still in process..but i think this is easy to do...it just costs some PR time,and we can have great surprises,and i´m pretty sure Fireball is quite agree with this University idea.
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:04 pm

Great! Looks like you have a handle on things, so you'll be Squad leader for this thing!
I dunno what to do anymore so if you have any clear and direct orders to give. Just shout or PM me and I will come help if it's within my competence.

In the meantime I want to try and circumvent all of the European red tapes. To test if it will work and maybe create a shortcut for ReactOS.

jgwright
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by jgwright » Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:58 am

I think it will be easier creating a Plan with some Universities who wants to join it.
Each student has to do a final work...
Sounds like Google Summer of Code. ReactOS was involved in 2006 but not since, correct me if I'm wrong. I don't know if there were any problems but ReactOS should try to get involved again next year. Targetting 'Universtities' - plural - it sounds like there'd be a problem with the mentor > student availability. GSoC makes an easier target, no?

vicmarcal
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by vicmarcal » Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:17 pm

Well..Gsoc has refused us since 2005(2006?) without any clear reason.So we have to find another alternative/parallel way.
When talking about Universities, i stated my idea of few Universities at the beginning,maybe 2 or 3...so we can check if this is (or isnt) the correct way to boost ReactOS development and it will give us time to solve any issues that the we can find the first year. 2 or 3 will lead to maybe 4 or 5 students(not much more) which will have mainly some advice from their teachers and their general doubts would be solved in the IRC+Wiki+Docu and their specific doubts can be solved through Dev-ML.Their work can be tracked thanks to Iserv.
These works arent supposed to be quite difficult(not a "Develop all the USB support" project, but a "Fixing 100 Winetests of this ReactOS DLL", "Check why these 3 Bugs are happening","Check why the USB Human interface are not working","Document our Win32k",...etc). They have to be quite defined,they have to be medium skilled issues, so maybe these students would continue improving ReactOS code after the University.
The new university plan called "Bolonia" is based in "external" works, giving to "external works" much more priority than the "final exams". Maybe we can indeed use this Plan to offer indeed much easier works to guys of 3rd University course.
As you can see i dont believe in a Direct Mentor inside ReactOS since there are Devs who doesnt want to mentor anyone(because lack of time), but i am pretty sure they will answer any doubt through the ML or IRC as they have been doing for ages. Of course if any Dev wants to mentor he can take it personally, but the idea is avoiding Direct Mentors and following the idea of a Comunnity Mentorship, as we have done for years too.
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Witch
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Re: Which universities produces qualified OS devs?

Post by Witch » Sat Sep 12, 2009 9:02 pm

vicmarcal's university plan (Bolonia?) is important for ReactOS in the long term. It brings a sense of continuity if there are some universities/professors who can vouch for this project.

If you manage to persuade universities or professors to sponsor the ReactOS project. Not necessarily through means of money just having the affirmation is enough. Then persuading companies to sponsor the ReactOS project will be easier. With universities and companies working together in a Consortium towards one goal. Applying for big long term funds will be easier.

GSoC seems interesting but it doesn't unlock ReactOS's true special powers ;) Still GSoC would be great for PR and all that.

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