windows 7 beta

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Lone_Rifle
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Lone_Rifle »

The Engadget team seem to be unable to turn on transparency in 7's Aero. anybody experiencing similar issues?

Z98
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Z98 »

Wouldn't be surprised if the likes of Fedora or Suse used up to 512MB. Anyways, you're implying that somehow just because Win7 or Vista wasn't designed to run on hardware that's, what, 7 years old, that it sucks? How many people actually would go out and buy either so that they could install it on their old hardware? And Vista has already "won" by any metric considering its market share. And even with people claiming that it's a failure, it's beaten out basically all competition from other companies and organizations, save for Microsoft's own products, which means MS is making money anyways. Companies in general never move quickly, since some were still using Windows 2000 when Vista came out. And if you're convinced that Win7 will be a failure, then you're free to not use it.

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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Lone_Rifle »

Granted, but bear in mind that a number of companies have explicitly expressed the view that they are not intending to move from Vista, which is somewhat interesting. Also, I do not totally agree with the view that one has to upgrade his or her hardware just so that they can run a better operating system - the transition from Win2K to WinXP, and to a lesser extent from NT4 to 2K went relatively well because the two operating systems ran fairly well even on so-so hardware (granted, not 7 year old hardware, 4 years would be more realistic, which would also happen to be the approximate time period between XP and Vista).

On the other hand so can Vista, so long as Aero is turned off. But surely that negates the point of upgrading to Vista, since most of the other improvements in Vista are only relevant to more savvy users?

vicmarcal
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by vicmarcal »

Z98 wrote:Wouldn't be surprised if the likes of Fedora or Suse used up to 512MB.
I havent seem them using that amount of Ram.I have seen Vista/7 using that amount. This is the actual reality.
Z98 wrote: Anyways, you're implying that somehow just because Win7 or Vista wasn't designed to run on hardware that's, what, 7 years old, that it sucks?
I have never said that.Never you will see a "suck" world in my answer, i´m respectul. I said not all Companies have hardware enough to run 7:that is going to limit 7 introduction in Companies market.That is a fact,imho.With a 1,5 year is enough to dont have Vista/7 working properly in Laptops.
Z98 wrote:How many people actually would go out and buy either so that they could install it on their old hardware? And Vista has already "won" by any metric considering its market share. And even with people claiming that it's a failure, it's beaten out basically all competition from other companies and organizations, save for Microsoft's own products, which means MS is making money anyways.
People dont buy OS for its home(of course there are exceptions as Black_Fox).Vista has increased its market share since people has bought more PCs,and since (almost)all these PCs comes with Vista installed. People werent buying Vista,they were buying PCs.
BTW the most installed OS by HP was "Vista downgrade to XP" OS. The word "downgrade" has increased its popularity while "Vista" complains appear.That means something.People are downgrading.
Companies in general never move quickly, since some were still using Windows 2000 when Vista came out. And if you're convinced that Win7 will be a failure, then you're free to not use it.
I said 7 is going to Fail.And after that i explain i was talking about Companies.But yes, after touching 7 a lot it isnt going to substitute my XP (able to run 7 without problems)in my PC if the performance is same as this Beta.
Black_Fox wrote:Vicmarcal: How exactly does Linux-hater translate to Windows-fanboy? There are more OSes than these two..
How do u translate Linux-hater from Geds words?You are tranlating it,not me ;).
He seems he is defending Windows,that´s why i said he is a Windows-fanboy.I didnt talk a word about Linux. BTW i prefer Mac. So yes there are others OS... ;)
Black_Fox wrote:And I HAVE paid for my license, so yes, I can have an opinion for that, even thought I am a home user that has bought "only" one license.
Anyone who have tested XP is enough good to have an opinion about it.She doesnt need to buy it to "have a valid opinion".
And congratulations, you are a nice boy :D...you are legal.Not all are...or are XP/Vista torrents seeders,leechers buying XP/Vista os?

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Black_Fox
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Black_Fox »

vicmarcal wrote:How do u translate Linux-hater from Geds words?
That was not translated from these words, it appeared on the forum or IRC before and I somehow remembered it.
vicmarcal wrote:And congratulations, you are a nice boy :D...you are legal.Not all are...
Actually I'm either paranoid, or not stupid (depends on reader's point of view) to boast about using stolen software ;) It's very trendy to steal software and to compete who has stolen more (see "epeen") for teenagers in our country, but I have grew up a bit since then.
Z98 wrote:Companies in general never move quickly
I know about companies in my region that try to save money so hard, that their hardware isn't able to work even with XP that is installed on it, let alone anything newer! (Also to note, the staff would take ages to retrain for Linux) Even when the managers know that and they still rather spend twice as much money for tech support (which obviously cannot do anything with insufficient HW).

Haos
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Haos »

I havent seen any distro eating 500 Mb Ram yet. and you z98?. Of course each year and each OS will eat more RAM than the previous,but 500MB is too much.7 is also,nowadays, a Beta,with some Services not running yet,so this 500MB is going to be more in Final Release:Approaching dangerously to the Vista´s 700MB.
I somehow managed to run Win7 on 512MB VM, and guess what... there was around 100MB of free RAM left... on default install. And i seen distros with KDE/Gnome choking on 384 MB ram...

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Black_Fox
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Black_Fox »

Well, my and friend's experiences show that 7 can use as little as 380 MB RAM. My Vista eats up to 1500 MB RAM without running anything else (but I have 4 gigabytes altogether :) ) I hope 7 has even more balanced memory usage (because having 3 free gigabytes just to have them is contraproductive as well as having no free memory at all). I also examined calc and mspaint a little closer. Calc has got some nice refreshing touches, mainly not anymore half-assed statistics module and guess what? Unit conversion :) There are some useful units I'll produce patch from and give to Carlo to include into RosCalc.

EDIT: clarified some parts

vicmarcal
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by vicmarcal »

Black_Fox wrote: My Vista eats up to 1500 MB RAM without running anything else (but I have 4 gigabytes altogether :) )
1500MB?Are u sure u arent running anything else?My Vista isnt eating more than 700MBram...I have 2 gigas here.

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Black_Fox
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Black_Fox »

I count everything into account, which could potentially amount to, say, 200 megabytes, but rest is Vista. I hope such amount of memory stops swapping at least.

Haos
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Haos »

And how exactly do you measure your memory usage?

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Black_Fox
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Black_Fox »

I don't know how exactly is it called (Private working set?), but it can be seen in Task manager and I use All CPU Meter to see it. It's nothing exact I guess...

Haos
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Haos »

Try to use Process Explorer. Windows, especially from Vista upwards, uses RAM aggresively as System Cache. Many people mistake it as memory used by the OS itself... This memory is only used when free, as apps request their share, the system cache is being limited.

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Black_Fox
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Black_Fox »

Thanks for the link, I'll look into it later. I consider the number as memory used by OS (as I can see, slightly incorrectly), but I'm content with it as it's much better than feeding electricity to memory that does nothing :) Also, if there is someone with real-life experience, is 4 GB memory enough to turn pagefile off? I usually don't use too much memory, apart from occasional 7-zip compressing with 2500 MB dictionary or playing games, that usually eat up to 1 GB...

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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Haos »

You should never disable the pagefile, it is a vital part of NT memory management system.

Mrkaras
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Re: windows 7 beta

Post by Mrkaras »

the page file is not all that important, xp embeded has is disabled by default. that said, I wouldn't suguest disabling it on a normal system dispite the aparent lack of its need I do bielieve it does do something important.

I tried win7 on a virtual machiene. not a big change from vista just a few bits and peices fixed up a bit. I'm not sure I like the new task bar with all the icons on the quick launch bar and the task bar looking the same but it probably just taks some getting uset to. being in a VM I couldn't turn on aero and I think that disabled some to my task bar's efects too.

I can't realy coment on the speed as it was in a VM but I'm sure it will be like all previous versions, it will be faster only if you put it on suitable hardware. try win95 vs winxp on a pentium 100, I think you will find win95 faster, try the same OS's on a 3ghz PC and I think you will find winxp is faster. I find the same with vista (and I'm sure win7) it is better but only past a certain point where it will become worse if the hardware is not up to it.

I tried to copy the new calculator and wordpad from win7 but I couldn't get it to work, anybody know how to move programs with .MUI files such as vista/win7 exes?

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